Animal Consciousness

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Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
Dennis Hackethal·​#5681·​
2nd of 2 versions leading to #5691 (2 total)
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Vincent Brunsch’s avatar
Vincent Brunsch·​#5678·​·​AI-assisted

In the reasoning you link in support of animal insentience, you argue that sentience and the capacity for universal creativity/critical thought come as a package deal. Dreaming seems to provide evidence against that connection.

Ordinary dreams can involve vivid visual experience, fear, pleasure, pain, etc., while metacognition, reality testing and critical reflection are greatly diminished. Lucid dreaming makes the distinction especially interesting: metacognitive awareness can return during an already conscious dream. The dream does not become phenomenally conscious only when lucidity begins; rather, an additional capacity for recognizing and critically reflecting on the experience appears.

This suggests that phenomenal experience can occur independently of the active critical capacities you take animals to lack.

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Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
Dennis Hackethal·​#5680·​

This suggests that phenomenal experience can occur independently of the active critical capacities you take animals to lack.

I don’t think so, since, as you write yourself, the critical attitude while dreaming is only “diminished”, not completely gone.

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Vincent Brunsch’s avatar
Vincent Brunsch·​#5684·​·​AI-assisted

If vivid phenomenal experience persists while the relevant critical capacities are greatly diminished (and some forms of meta-awareness appear to be absent altogether in ordinary dreams) that seems at least evidence that phenomenal experience does not closely depend on the degree to which those capacities are active. Lucid dreaming strengthens this: reflective/metacognitive capacities can return within an experience that was already phenomenal.

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Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
Dennis Hackethal·​#5691·​

I usually find that terms like “phenomenal experience” and “cognition” are confusing and make discussions harder. Ultimately, there’s one type of consciousness and one type of information processing that gives rise to it. I don’t think distinctions between different types of ‘cognition’ or ‘experience’ are worth drawing, if they even exist in reality at all.

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Vincent Brunsch’s avatar
Vincent Brunsch·​#5738·​·​AI-assisted

By “phenomenal experience” I simply mean there being something it is like to see red, feel pain, fear, etc. Your claim that animals are insentient is itself a claim that these experiences are absent.

Whether such experience can occur without universal/critical cognition is precisely what is under dispute. So saying that these distinctions may not exist, because ultimately there is one kind of information processing that gives rise to consciousness, seems to assume the package-deal hypothesis rather than provide an argument for it.

If there is an independent reason why phenomenal experience cannot occur without universal creativity, that would address the criticism. But I don’t think collapsing the distinction itself does.

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