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Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
2nd of 5 versions

Veritula should have some way to indicate agreement; some way to indicate that a particular thread of a discussion is resolved, at least for the time being.

CriticismCriticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

If there’s no criticism, that implies agreement.

Criticism of #2169Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
2nd of 2 versions

Not necessarily. Maybe somebody just forgot to reply or doesn’t know what to say.

Criticism of #2157
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

How about emoji reactions?

Battle tested
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

People could wrongly think they have epistemological relevance. For example, they might adopt an idea that has pending criticism just because it got positive reactions.

Criticism of #2159Criticized2
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Reactions could be limited to the recipient of a comment.

Criticism of #2160Criticized3
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

That limits the scope of the problem but doesn’t eliminate it. A single recipient could still react in a distracting way.

Criticism of #2161
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

There’s value in reacting to top-level ideas, too.

Criticism of #2161
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

There’s value in others being able to react as well. Maybe an idea affects them in some way or they want to voice support.

Criticism of #2161
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

There could be an explanation somewhere stating that emoji reactions do not have epistemological relevance.

Criticism of #2160Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Hardly anyone reads those, and many of those who do forget.

Criticism of #2243
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

The red “Criticized” label is far more prominent than reactions would be.

Criticism of #2160
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

In a way, reactions might have epistemological relevance.

If an idea has pending criticisms, it can still have parts worth saving in a revision. Reactions based on paragraphs (#2458) could point out those parts.

Criticism of #2160
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Reactions can be ambiguous. It wouldn’t always be clear which part of an idea someone is reacting to.

Criticism of #2159Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

That only happens if people submit bulk ideas, and people shouldn’t do that anyway.

Criticism of #2166Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

But not everyone will always use the platform in an ideal way, and I don’t want to make it easier for issues to compound.

Criticism of #2167
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

I could implement reactions on a per-paragraph basis.

Criticism of #2166Criticized2
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

It isn’t clear what would happen during a revision. A paragraph might be changed or deleted. Too complicated.

Criticism of #2458Criticized2
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

But presumably, the same is true for reactions to ideas as a whole. Reactions would have to be removed for revisions.

Criticism of #2461
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

For reactions to paragraphs, at least you could tell if the content someone reacted to has changed, and only then remove the reaction.

Criticism of #2461
Benjamin Davies’s avatar

Why should reacts persist through revisions?

Criticism of #2461Criticized1
Benjamin Davies’s avatar

Nevermind, this was addressed by #2462

Criticism of #2468
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Then what does somebody do who wants to react to an idea as a whole? Do they react to the last paragraph?

Criticism of #2458
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

The way I picture it, as you hover over different paragraphs, a reaction button appears and moves between paragraphs. So it would always be clear that reactions are on specific paragraphs. The user would pick whatever paragraph they most wish to react to.

Criticism of #2464Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

But this doesn’t address the scenario where someone wants to react to no particular paragraph but the idea as a whole.

Criticism of #2465
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Too complicated/ambitious for a first implementation. Start piecemeal. But could be a promising approach if reactions to ideas as a whole end up being ambiguous (#2166).

Criticism of #2458
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

I can speculate ahead of time, but I might implement reactions and find that this is not an issue after all. And if it is, I can either retire the feature or improve it.

Criticism of #2166
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Those run the risk of turning Veritula into yet another social network like Reddit or messenger like Telegram.

Criticism of #2159Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Not if I do reactions on a per-paragraph basis. I think that’s a new feature none of those sites have.

Criticism of #2242
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
2nd of 2 versions

The purpose of the reaction would be to record a kind of agreement or acknowledgment.

That way, Veritula could show unacknowledged criticisms to users. So in addition to revising or counter-criticizing, they get a chance to acknowledge a criticism without having to comment.

Posting arbitrary emojis doesn’t achieve that purpose.

Criticism of #2159Criticized1
Benjamin Davies’s avatar

This is a good idea.

I often receive criticisms that I have no counter-criticisms for, and it would be nice to be able to acknowledge those, both as a way to display gratitude, and as a way to indicate that I think something is tentatively settled.

Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
3rd of 3 versions

Posting arbitrary emojis doesn’t achieve that purpose.

Maybe it does. Any kind of reaction is a response that turns a criticism from unacknowledged to acknowledged.

Criticism of #4116
Benjamin Davies’s avatar

I like the acknowledged/unacknowledged idea.

Benjamin Davies’s avatar
2nd of 2 versions

Doesn’t need to be arbitrary emojis, it could just be a handful that you choose, each being a different flavour of acknowledgement.

Thumbs up,
Thinking emoji,
Mind-blown emoji,
Etc.

Edit: X spaces are an example of a limited set of emojis working well.

Criticism of #4116Criticized2
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

I think the reason the limited set works well in X spaces is that there’s no text input. So there’s no way to sidestep the restriction.

For Veritula, it would be more like an emoji restriction on tweets. That wouldn’t work because you couldn’t stop people from posting arbitrary emojis in tweets by just typing them with their keyboards.

Criticism of #4107
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Edit: …

Pointing out changes is discouraged. Version history and diffing take care of that for you.

Criticism of #4107
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

The Effective Altruism forum has an interesting way to react to posts.

There’s an ‘Agree’ button and a ‘Disagree’ button. Those are apparently anonymous. Then separately, there’s a button to ‘Add a reaction’ of either ‘Heart’, ‘Helpful’, ‘Insightful’, ‘Changed my mind’, or ‘Made me laugh’. And those are apparently not anonymous.

I wonder why they chose to make some reactions anonymous but not others. I don’t think I’d want a ‘Heart’ or ‘Made me laugh’ button, they seem too social-network-y. Also, ‘Heart’ seems like a duplicate of ‘Agree’. But ‘Insightful’ and ‘Changed my mind’ seem epistemologically relevant. Maybe ‘Helpful’, too.

If I did decide to go with ‘Agree’ and ‘Disagree’ buttons, I wouldn’t make them anonymous, though.

Criticized1
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar
2nd of 2 versions

This seems both complicated and restrictive. People could easily sidestep the restriction anyway: nothing stops someone from leaving a comment with only a single emoji in it.

Criticism of #3121
Dennis Hackethal’s avatar

Superseded by #4120. This comment was generated automatically.

Criticism of #2169