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Neil Hudson says in response to the bounty:

I wonder if this objection risks making a Hilbertian mistake: assuming that an objective criterion must provide a universal decision procedure. Gödel taught us not to equate objectivity with decidability. Why should HTV need to algorithmically rank every pair of explanations to be meaningful?

#5419​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 3 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized3

I point out that he and I have already discussed that. He has so far ignored the tentative outcome of that discussion, which leaves my stance with zero pending criticisms and his with five (at the time of writing), see #5340.

#5418​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 3 days ago​·​Criticism

Brett says “Rational decision making is not a matter of pulling a lever and cranking through a calculation.”

#5417​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 3 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

Dirk replies that the bounty doesn’t ask for essentialist definitions. It instead asks for clarity around how to actually use HTV.

#5416​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 3 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

Brett says the bounty is “impossible” because “it’s asking for a definition for something that *cannot be defined* in the way the challenge demands.”

#5415​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 3 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

Related: #5354 and comments.

#5414​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 4 days ago

I don’t care whether people agree with me about this. I care about what’s true, what the ideas imply, as written. Ironically, chapter 1 also says theories can have implications their authors did not intend or may not like (p. 27):

What if you’d rather not know? You may not like these predictions.
Your friends and colleagues may ridicule them. You may try to modify
the explanation so that it will not make them
… You will fail.

#5412​·​Dennis HackethalOP revised 4 days ago​·​Original #5365​·​Criticism

I don’t care whether people agree with me about this. I care about what’s true, what the ideas imply, as written. Ironically, chapter 1 also says theories can have implications their authors did not intend or may not like (p. 27):

What if you’d rather not know? You may not like these predictions.
Your friends and colleagues may ridicule them. You may try to modify
the explanation so that it will not make them

#5410​·​Dennis HackethalOP revised 4 days ago​·​Original #5365​·​CriticismCriticized1

Citation needed. You of all people should know to cite since you hate when others cite from memory. Don’t be a hypocrite.

#5409​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 4 days ago​·​Criticism

I reply:

BoI is full of remarks about preference formation. Doing word searches for “choose between” and “rival explanation”, we can find, for example:

“… we should choose between [policies or theories] not on the basis of their origin, but according to how good they are as explanations: how hard to vary.” (209)

“… how does the ‘dictator’ itself choose between rival explanations …?” (341)

“[The] main use [of experience] is to choose between theories that have already been guessed.” (4)

“The role of experiment and observation is to choose between existing theories…” (32)

I later found more evidence running a word search for the string ‘prefer’:

“Whenever a wide range of variant theories can account equally well for the phenomenon they are trying to explain, there is no reason to prefer one of them over the others, so advocating a particular one in preference to the others is irrational.” (21, emphasis mine)

And chapter 13 is virtually all about forming rational preferences.

Then there’s TCS common-preference finding…

#5407​·​Dennis HackethalOP revised 4 days ago​·​Original #5359​·​Criticism

The wrapper provides no immunity. If X’s flaw defeats the proposed use, that flaw can criticise the new policy too. ‘This bridge design collapses, but keep using it’ is criticised by the danger of collapse. Therefore, not almost any criticised idea becomes adoptable this way.

#5405​·​Benjamin Davies revised 4 days ago​·​Original #5390​·​Criticism

Ben explored and addressed this criticism in more detail, see #5382.

#5403​·​Dennis HackethalOP revised 5 days ago​·​Original #5402

Ben explored and addressed this criticism in more detail, see #5382.

#5402​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 5 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

The wrapper provides no immunity. If X’s flaw defeats the proposed use, that flaw can criticize the new policy too. ‘This bridge design collapses, but keep using it’ is criticised by the danger of collapse. Therefore, not almost any criticised idea becomes adoptable this way.

#5400​·​Benjamin Davies revised 5 days ago​·​Original #5390​·​CriticismCriticized1

I reply that “Not all programs prompt users for input at runtime”

#5399​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 5 days ago​·​Criticism

Tyler says “All known programs to date” outsource creative input to the user.

#5398​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 5 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

This is addressed in section 5 of Dennis' paper: The Structure of Rational Thought.

‘How can we rationally proceed when all known ideas have pending criticisms?’
By treating ideas as immutable and discrete, even if content overlaps. For example, as a description of reality, general relativity has pending criticisms. But there are no serious contenders. Instead, take the idea: ‘Although GR has pending criticisms as a true description of reality, it’s an excellent approximation, makes precise predictions, and powers technology such as GPS. So we keep using it until we find a replacement.’ As written, this idea has no pending criticisms, so its advocacy is rational.

#5397​·​Dennis HackethalOP revised 5 days ago​·​Original #5384​·​Criticism Battle-tested

Quote missing italics.

#5396​·​Dennis HackethalOP, 5 days ago​·​Criticism

This does not identify an error in #5387. It only says ‘there are no serious contenders’ can be criticised, which is exactly what #5387 is doing.”

#5395​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​Criticism

“There are no serious contenders” is itself merely another conjecture inside the composite idea. It too can be criticised and revised recursively.

#5394​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

The criterion excludes comparing the strength of criticisms, not comparison altogether. ‘Serious’ could be binary: does the contender solve the same problems, reproduce GR’s successful predictions, and lack a pending criticism that prevents replacing GR?

#5393​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​Criticism

The wrapper provides no immunity. If X’s flaw defeats the proposed use, that flaw can criticize the new policy too. ‘This bridge design collapses, but keep using it’ is criticised by the danger of collapse. Therefore, not almost any criticized idea becomes adoptable this way.

#5391​·​Benjamin Davies revised 5 days ago​·​Original #5390​·​CriticismCriticized1

The wrapper provides no immunity. If X’s flaw defeats the proposed use, that flaw can criticize the new policy too. ‘This bridge design collapses, but keep using it’ is criticized by the danger of collapse. Therefore, not almost any criticized idea becomes adoptable this way.

#5390​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​CriticismCriticized1

‘X is true’ and ‘use X for purpose Y while acknowledging that X is not true’ are different proposals. A criticism of X as a true description does not necessarily criticise its bounded use.

#5389​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​Criticism

This assumes ‘approximation’ means measurable closeness to an unknown final theory. In context, it actually means that GR’s predictions closely approximate observed gravitational behaviour in its tested domains. We can compare predictions with observations without knowing the final theory.

#5388​·​Benjamin Davies, 5 days ago​·​Criticism